Packers future not bleak

After the latest meltdown by the Packers this season, I had to sit back for a change and try to gather my emotions. No such luck, I guess. But still, even with the disappointment of this season still really two weeks away, I don’t think the Packers are in for 20 years of losing like many of the comments here have suggested. Today’s NFL won’t allow that. Just ask Miami. The Packers are solid on offense and whether or not you like Aaron Rodgers, the fact is unless he gets hurt he will continue to get better. During the Packers 20 years of losing, quarterback was the main problem. However, when they finally got a good one – Lynn Dickey, they had the same problems Rodgers and the Packers have now. No freaking defense. The Packers 48-47 Monday  win over the Redskins in 1983 was a typical game. It was like being in the WAC or something.

The 2008 Packers are almost identical, the big difference is Dickey was simply unstoppable at that stage of his career. With Lofton, John Jefferson and Paul Coffman, the Packers literally could score on any play, the problem was, so could the opponent. The tone was set opening day when the Packers beat the Oilers 41-38. Only twice that year did the Packers give up less than 21 points. Dickey threw for 4458 yards, a Packers record that will never be broken. It was Dickey who was able to at least get the Packers to a 8-8 record. For whatever reason, whether lack of experience or lack of confidence from his head coach, AaronRodgers has not been able to be that difference maker. The only difference on offense is that Dickey had a Pro Bowl tight end (oh yeah, the Packers could have had one of those a few weeks ago), but other than that, the offense is comparable. In fact, Greg Jennings is twice the receiver John Jefferson was. Lofton was a Hall-of-Famer, however, so I guess it evens out.

The biggest difference between those teams and now however is leadership. I’m not saying Ted Thompson and Mark Murphy are the greatest things since sliced bread, I’m saying the structure of the Packers is much different. Back then the team president had more to say about who was coaching and who made the team than many owners did. In 1982 Robert J. Parins replaced Dominic Olejniczak, who had been president since 1958, for heavens sakes. When Bob Harlan took over in 1989 things started to improve, especially when Harlan gave total football operations to a general manager. You may not like this general manager, but what I’m saying is as long as this structure remains in effect, the the Packers will not go through another stretch of losing like they did in the 70s and 80s. That is assuming Murphy makes the right call on the next GM.

I personally think the immediate future is very bright, provided Thompson addresses the Packers’ problems on defense. What was supposed to be a strong point this season with a first-year starting quarterback, turned into a nightmare and doomed the team from the get-go. We should have know we were in trouble when the Lions stormed to a 25-24 lead in the fourth quarter of week two. Thank Thompson for Charles Woodson and Nick Collins for that one. The Packers do have talent on defense, but the coaching talent is not the same. My choice for 2009 defensive coordinator would be the soon to be fired Lions’ coach Rod Marinelli. Anybody who can keep a winless team playing that hard and has the defensive background he has, working for Monte Kiffin, is good in my book. I wouldn’t mind Mike Nolan, either, but please no Jim Haslett.

If the Packers can improve the defense, especially the front seven, and continue to develop not only Rodgers, but Greg Jennings and receivers James Jones and Jordy Nelson, the future is bright. Donald Driver still has a few good years in him as well. To me, though, Driver is one of the guys who is at a crossroads. Driver should have been the veteran leadership on this team but have you ever heard Driver and word leadership mentioned in the same sentence? I haven’t. Driver might be playing elsewhere next year.

The Packers are still the youngest team in the NFL and at some point they have to age if they are going to win a championship. This goes for coaching too. When the Packers were winning in the 1990s most of the offensive staff and some of the defensive staff ended up with head coaching jobs in the NFL. I don’t think any of head coach Mike McCarthy’s current staff is too sought after right now. Changes need to be made, no doubt, but I think they need to start at the coaching level , not at the GM level. Not head coach, but the assistants leave more than a little to be desired. McCarthy needs to almost clean house if you ask me. He was young and inexperienced when he hired this staff and now it’s time for some of them to go. McCarthy is well respected and I don’t think he would have a problem hiring replacements.

The thing is, one player did not make the Packers 5-9. This season had to come at some point. It was made that much harder by  the unexpected success of last season. I think if the Packers could somehow win the last two games, they could feel pretty good about themselves heading into the offseason of change. There will be a new defensive coordinator, for sure, and he will bring in his own people. Charles Woodson and Al Harris will have to adjust if they want to win. Woodson has shown that is no problem by his moving to safety this year. I could see a change at offensive coordinator as well. I know MM is the main man, but the OC has to at least be able to have people lined up in the right spots.

All I want to see is a win over the Bears, especially if the Vikings lose to Atlanta Sunday. Wouldn’t it be ironic that when the Bears suck and the Packers are good we can’t beat them but when they are good and we suck we can? Irony can be pretty ironic.

This entry was posted on Wednesday, December 17th, 2008 at 8:52 pm and is filed under Al Davis. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.

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  • Jeff

    I’ll blame them to this extent –

    Either Ted has been unable to provide or Mike has been unable to develop one single effective lineman on either side of the ball since their arrival. Pickett and Jenkins (both FAs) are the only exceptions. Not one draft pick has really come through. This represents (in my opinion) a long standing inability to identify and/or develop line talent.

    Is it too much to hope that we get one good player a year on those lines? Given 2 good O-linemen and two good D-linemen, I think we win those close games and are sitting at 9-5 with the tie-breakers. Hell, the only games we were really out of were New Orleans, Tampa and Dallas. This team is not far from 11-3.

    A little more pressure, a little better run-game, a little less pressure on Rodgers and I think this team is a great deal more competitive. I put much of that on Ted and Mike for not building better lines on both sides of the ball.

    I’ll grant the injuries to players like Barnett, Jenkins and Tauscher have hurt. Declining talents like KGB and Clifton have hurt. But the main revelation there is that Ted and Mike have not been doing a good job of filling in behind them. The guys stepping in like Poppinga, Moll and Cole just aren’t that good. Whether it’s a matter of talent or coaching or both, I don’t have the skills to say. I’m just a fan who played a little high school ball. It does seem clear to me that our guys up front just aren’t quite getting it done.

  • Larry

    OK, true, but too heavy on TT. Best GM we ever had had 2#1s,2#2s, and 10 picks in the 1st 7 RNDS. His 1st 2 picks were Terrell Buckley and Mark D’Onofrio. He got Brooks in 3rd, Bennett in 4th and Chmura in 6th, good starters but hardly perenial All-Pro. Thats it; I think TT did better than that w/AROD alone. I’m just a fan too, with no real technical football knowledge, but I see basically a good team. Given the above, even taking into account the Harrell disaster somehow we did a better job on D last year(other than the take-aways). Anybody who saw this happening last Spring should have contacted TT and cited their credentials to make that prediction. I just know that TT would have done something to prevent it

  • paul

    Dan, you must have forgotten, Forrest (Gump) Gregg won a superbowl with the Bungles before coming to GB. My fear with Cowher at 8 mill per year.

  • Jeff

    Yeah – that’s why I left it open. I can’t say with my knowledge whether the problem is that we’re not getting the right talent or that we’re not doing a good job of developing it, but I’ll be honest, I lean towards the former.

    Wolf didn’t do so great in ’92, but in the following years, you see guys like Earl Dotson, Aaron Taylor, Adam Timmerman, Mike Flanigan, Marco Rivera, Vonnie Holliday, Mike Wahle. Not necessarily all-pros, but solid players all. Year by year, quality players came on board through the draft. Add in signings like White, Brown, Dotson and Jones, and that’s a lot of line talent coming within a five year span 93-98.

    Of course, we also drafted Ross Verba and John Michiels as successive first rounders – so I’m not quite sure where I’m going with this except to say that, by comparison with that period, we’re not doing so great these last five years. We haven’t gotten one good lineman out of the draft since Wells in 2004. Before that Kampman in 2002. Before that, you have to go back to 2000 when we got Clifton, Tauscher, and KGB in one draft. That’s a long time to go without much quality new blood on the lines. Sherman didn’t leave the team in good shape in this regard.

    This team needed help on the O-line in Ted’s first year – it’s four years later, and we’re in the same boat with aging tackles to boot. That’s why I’m kinda heavy on TT. He’s had 43 draft picks – 13 have been spent on linemen. Not one has been an impact player. That’s just not very good. OK, to be fair, leave out the 2008 draft and call it 34 picks with 10 devoted to linemen. That’s still not good.

    And I will point out that (while I had zero credentials to say it) this is exactly what I was saying at the end of last season after watching the Giants totally stuff our run game. Yeah, he-who-must-not-be-named threw the final lame duck, but our inability to run the ball effectively or execute a decent screen pass should not have been overlooked.

    To make a short statement after a long post, I just don’t think this team gets a lot better without attending to the lines in a relatively major way. 2 or 3 free agent signings and hope we get lucky with pick like Tauscher.

  • Larry

    Yep, just trying to keep my rose colored specs from fogging.

  • CheesyD

    Looks like the Packers will get a third rounder for Favre. He went 18/31 for 187 yards, threw two INTs, zero TDs, and the lowly Seahawks thumped the Jets 13-3. The Jets playoff hopes are pretty much dead. The Jets need to beat Miami and hope for help to get into the playoffs.

  • Larry

    Hmmm! Cold, snow, miserable, 39. Enough said.

  • Larry

    Hey, CheesyD, you’re cruel. That damned TT; he is so devious, everybody knows he does better in the 3rd than 1st……………………!

  • CheesyD

    16° here on the coast of Maine this morning. We got a hefty 13″ of snow last night. Just got done clearing the driveway and now I get to go to work! Yahoo!! (grumble, grumble). I’m recording the game tonight so won’t be able to see it until after midnight tonight or tomorrow morning. GO PACK!! The Be*rs still suck!!

  • Dan

    Paul wrote…
    “you must have forgotten, Forrest (Gump) Gregg won a superbowl with the Bungles before coming to GB. My fear with Cowher at 8 mill per year.”

    Paul, check your facts!!! Yes, Gregg made it to the Superbowl but Montana led the 49ers to the comeback victory.

    Gregg record before coming to GB (50-48-1 in the regular season). That includes a scab season 7-2 record.

    Cowher’s record 149-90-1.

  • Matt Hayton

    Went and took my boy to see the great one, play like an old man in the snow in Seattle. It was a great lifelong memory that I will cherish for the rest of my life. We had great end zone seats adn someday my bot will be able to say he saw the great Brett Favre play, like my dad talks about having seen Bart Starr, I missed out on that by a couple of years…I just remember him as a coach.

    That being said. Favre looked bad, and as much of supporter of his that I have been. I ultimately think both sides are getting what they deserved. Funny how fate has a way of serving justice.

    As far as Cowher, the exact reason why I think it would be a good thing for this franchise, is the reason why it won’t happen. Cowher would disagree with TT and challenge him when TT needs challenging (ie – drafting a WR in the 1st round vs. going defense). Right now there are no opposing viewpoints being shared at 1265. Just TT’s. Which smells a little bit like Sherman to me. It takes a big man to take and utilize criticsim, instead of being threatened by it.

    But like I said, I don’t see it happening, TT’s got his guy and he’s gonna stick with him. Especially only one year into new contracts. My realistic hope for this offseason is: Moss replaces Sanders as DC. Upgrade over Stock if a better special teams guy can be found. Of course much of our special teams woes were due to Frost and not Stock, atleast that is where a majority of the blame needs to go…so I’m okay if they stick with/Stock.

    And realistically, I’d like to see 2 free agents of starting caliber brought in on either the offensive of defensive lines (2 Total).

    And then in the draft, address what you weren’t able to along the lines in FA, most likely: LT, and DE. They HAVE to get better along the lines between now and next fall. I think they have enough talent everywhere else to be successful, now they must develop this team from the inside out. If they fail to address the lines this offseason, I really think they will both (MM and TT) be gone after next year. I don’t think either of them can survive another losing season.

  • paul

    Sorry Dan, had a brain fart. You are right about Gregg, I don’t know what I was thinking, however, would you still want Cowher at 8 mil per year? Sounds a bit steep and TT would never consider based on his past moves. Have a Merry Christmas and may the Pack beat the Bears. I still picked the Pack in office pool for tonight but I can only lose 5 dollars.

  • paul

    Here is how I see it. Not all of my words but is sums it up nicely.

    Where is the blame on Aaron Rogers…he has done a more than respectable job as (for all intent and purpose) a rookie. He will only get better if the coaching does not ruin him. I sure wish Mooch was here to tutor AR like he was at the beginning of Favre’s career…wait, was he not available for the head coaching job and all Favre asked was for TT to interview him and TT could not be honest about this too. On top of that, another year or two as Favre’s back-up with more playing experience in games over early or when Favre was off would have further enhanced the development of AR.

    You can blame Bob Sanders and Mike Stock and the underachieving lines and get rid of all of them. However, do you not have to first ask who is responsible for filling those spots…TT, of course. Therefore, let us take a look at what TT has done since coming to Titletown (the name long before TT arrived).

    First, he hired MM because he was dumber than himself, and thus TT could feel secure about himself. What a shame since Mooch and a whole host of other people qualified to be the Head Coach of what was once the greatest franchise in the NFL were out there. Instead, he hires MM who never won or built great offenses at SF or NO where he was the offensive coordinator before being hired by TT. In fact, both teams improved overall and offensively after MM left. Therefore, the failure of the zone blocking scheme and the development of offensive players, specifically, and all players, generally, should not be a surprise. Further, conservative and unimaginative play calling should not be a shock.

    Second, I strongly disagree that the next two games are meaningless. In fact, these games will tell a lot of the Packers because we will all get to see if the players will play for MM and TT. Remember, Ron Wolfe by acquiring Reggie White and Brett Favre restored Green Bay to Titletown for the first time since Lombardi and quality NFL players wanted to play in Green Bay.

    Third, do not make excuses about injuries. Mike Sherman was fired for going 4-12 when 75% of his starting line-up was out with injuries and it did not matter that in his 6 years with the Packers (including the 4-12 year) he had the 5th winningest record of NFL coaches based upon the number of games coached in the history of the NFL. Since TT laid all of the blame on Sherman for that season it would seem that the goose and the gander should fault TT and MM for all of the failures this year WITHOUT EXCUSES!!!

    Fourth, who is responsible for putting together the personnel on the defensive and offensive lines and then coaching this personnel. Sherman used to be blamed for all of the Packer personnel problems when MM started out. However, TT has had 4 drafts, MM has had 3 seasons, and the Packers went to within one game of the Super Bowl last year resulting in TT and MM getting 5 year contract extensions. In accordance, TT and MM jumped to the front to take the credit and now they can jump to the front to be accountable.

    Fifth, TT’s decision-making on the offensive line has been absolutely horrific. Since Tauscher and Clifton were both here when TT arrived he cannot take credit for them. Therefore, TT has acquired ABSOLUTELY NO offensive lineman who have made a positive difference since TT began drafting 4 YEARS AGO. TT, you cannot blame Sherman any more just as Bush cannot blame his predecessors for the current economic problems in this country. On top of that, the TT TE acquisitions have been equally pathetic.

    Sixth, TT’s decision-making on the defensive line has been equally terrible. Trading Corey Williams, drafting Justin Harrell, getting rid of Abdul Hodge (I know, he’s linebacker) and the list goes on and on. BTW, Al Harris was here before TT and Sharper is just finishing off a fine 3 year contract with the Viqueens since TT decided Sharper did not have anything left in the tank.

    Seventh, TT lets Longwell go and fortuitiously obtains Jon Ryan. However, because TT is smarter than everyone else he cuts Ryan just before the regular season begins and brings in Frost. This whole sequence of events epitomizes the incompetence of TT.

    Eighth, penalties and fundamental errors and the repitition of same throughout the season speaks volumes about the quality, or lack thereof, of coaching on the Packers. These are not high school players…these are the cream of the crop, the best of the best, these are professional football players playing the highest level of football on the planet.

    Ninth, Favre was the leadership and intangible, as well as the offensive coach last year when the Packers played so well. MM does not instill confidence and the only thing he might lead is to the trip to the food court.

    Finally, the buck stops with the GM–TT and the Head Coach–MM…not the assistant coaches to be the fall guys. The Packers are not a good team across the board and their record reflects same.

    I hear the train a comin’…it’s comin round the bend…BUH BYE TT and MM!!!

  • roy jamison

    All aboard…train leaving Green Bay for Podunk, Pitfield, and Perdition! All aboard!

  • Pack4life

    TT doesnt go after Free Agents. So anyone who compares him with Ron Wolf who traded for Favre and signed Reggie, IS A MORON

  • iccyfan

    paul writes: “Seventh, TT lets Longwell go and fortuitiously obtains Jon Ryan”
    ====================
    Longwell is a placekicker and Jon Ryan is a punter. Longwell was gone before Ryan arrived, so he didn’t even hold for him. What exactly is the connection you’re going for here?

    P.S. Longwell was a fine kicker, but Mason Crosby is better, now and future-wise.

  • Michael Legat

    With all due respect Pack4Life, anyone who thinks that doing business in the NFL in 2008 is the same as 1993 is also a moron.

  • Larry

    Methinks to soon throw TT overboard because of his drafts; when compared to Wolf he’s done as well. Wolfs first four #1s only produced Newsome, Taylor, Simmons, and Buckley. Not exactly household names. I realize you have to compare the whole draft but believe me its comparable to the above. And the effort put into trying to make something out of Buckley was a lot worse than Harrell, even if he never starts. In any case its water over the dam.

  • Pack4life

    LEGAT ITS EASIER NOW SEE BALTIMORE, ATLANTA, AND MIAMI! The Front Office and coaching staff benefited from a poor division that starts Tavaris Jackson, Kyle Orton and drum roll please Dan Orlavsky. With Aaron Rodgers starting, not winning this division is a disgrace. We have John Bleeping Kuhn and Jermichael Finley deciding games.
    TT has a penchant for letting players go i.e. Corey Williams, Jon Ryan and getting nothing in return

  • AATP

    Yippee!! Same ol’ crap out here… Go Pack – Da Bears still suck… Hope we get to prove it once again tonight… :)

  • zach

    Looking forward to the Pack-Bears live game blog…..c’mon Al, you know you want to……

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