Seems I always follow a Larrytex opinion…something about great minds…I find it odd that with a top 10 defense and offense that we bloggers continue to berate the job of MM and TT. To be sure the sacks and penalties are correctable and MM needs to start fining or benching repeat offenders…seems Singletary did it to Vernon Davis and it worked.

and as for the line being understaffed…I previously thought we were two tackles short but believe Lang is on the right side for good now. And for those old enough to remember Verba and Michels manned the 96 team (pro bowls—NOT). The difference of course is that that team utilized the more traditional WC offense with screen, slant and short tosses to the half and full backs.

I would like to see Green and Grant in the same backfield with Findley at TE and see which of the 3 is the most open..linebackers can’t really cover any of them. Food for thought.

Larry – “This results only attitude sets up the kind of situation I keep refering to in CHI and MIN.”

It’s a results only league. We don’t have anything else to judge upon. Either the team you put together can win or it can’t. That’s not at all meant to say that GMs should be judged upon the record of a single season, but at some point you either believe in a person’s ability to get you to the top or you don’t.

Looking back, I think Ted Thompson is a somewhat better than average GM. He took a team which had a cap problem and built a young talented team without breaking the bank. That’s not a bad thing. Now you have to ask yourself whether you think he has what it takes to get us to the next level. I’m intrigued by the possibility but remain somewhat skeptical.

I said at the beginning of this season that I figured this year was a “prove it” year for our leadership. Is this team closer to 13-3 or 6-10? Which season was the aberration? Are we a mediocre team that had a great year in 2007, or are we a very good team that had a crummy year in 2008? Are we building or floundering. At the moment, I don’t think we have enough facts in evidence to make that call, but after the Dallas win, I think finding out is going to be lot more fun than I thought last Sunday morn.

The Bills offers Brohm a two year deal. The Packers matched, but Brohm picked the Bills. If Brohm was not worth being on the 53 man roster at the beginning of the year, why is he now? TT decisions and planning make no sense.

Brohm did not play very good in the preseason, so now being on the practice squad for eight games changes his ability enough to be put back on the regular team.

Is TT worried about the probability of lossing one or both of our two QB’s because of our poor O-line? What is TT plan? It makes very little sense.

“And for those old enough to remember Verba and Michels manned the 96 team (pro bowls—NOT).”

I’m pretty sure Verba wasn’t around until 1997.

Cut myself off before I was through. My point was two fold; 1) we had a young, promising stable of OL that we supplemented through the draft and brought in a FA who wasn’t as good as what we had, and 2) there just wasn’t anything out there this year to address the potential of our OTs not being available.
If a mistake was made it was probably the ’08 draft where 8 OTs went in the 1st round. On the other hand we got Jordy, Finley, Flynn, Lee, Swain, Thompson, and oh yes, Brohm, but also, Sitton and Giacomini.
I still hold that you have to look at some reasoning at the time of the action rather than just the result. Thats how you throw out the baby with the bath water. And, we still don’t know yet how this kiddie corp is going to turn out in the long run.

I have a hard time debating that, Larry. Perhaps some of those players warming benches for other teams are better than our starters, but I lack sufficient knowledge of the players involved to make that argument.

All I can really say is that the O-line is clearly a significant liability at this point, and in my opinion, five years as a GM should be sufficient to construct an O-line that would be an asset. Your argument seems to be that nobody could construct a better line from the FA opportunities Ted Thompson had available.

And yet, we lead the league in sacks against at 41 – the closest competition is 9 behind us. Roughly half the league has 20 or less, and we’re in the middle of the pack on attempts. Clearly, other GM/Coach/player combinations are getting it done better than us. We have to compare the Packers’ performance against other NFL teams and not against what amatuer, sideshow GMs like us can contruct in our squishy little melons. The fact that you and I can’t come up with a better answer does not absolve Ted Thompson of his partial responsibility for this team being the worst in the NFL in this catagory.

Larry – Take a longer view. Good offensive lines are built over time. It’s just not often that you draft your tackles for the next decade the way we did Clifton and Tauscher.

The problems we’re experiencing are the culmination of years of decisions going back into the Sherman period. After we brought in our tackles in 2000, you don’t see a single decent O-line prospect coming out of the draft until Wells in the 7th round of 2004. That’s a problem.

Then we go through another gap until we get Colledge and Spitz in 2006. Nobody arrives in 2007. That’s three decent linemen drafted between 2000 and 2008. I think the problem was significant long before Sitton and Lang arrived.

Since 2000, we’ve had one second round pick and no first round picks on the O-line. I hang a significant portion of this around Mike Sherman’s neck, but Ted’s the captain now. He needs to take action to right this ship.

Oh, no question, Oddball, you’re quite right. My argument re injuries last year gets thrown out by most, here, but its true non the less. Too damned much movement among the different positions. Then, bang, for some reason only known to god (little g) the same thing this year. You don’t develop a cohisive line that way.
Very simple comeback used to my logic – TT should have known better and anticipated since injuries are part of the game.
Yeah, right, but teams with a lot of ‘em don’t win either!
Hey, talk about anticipation, how many draft picks were used to build the Fab(5). Too many? What if our 33 year old WR leader had gone down – we then would not have been the Fab(4) with all those kids playing multiple chairs in the receiver position; I dont think they would have developed the way they would have w/o Driver.
Besides, I think RB is a bigger problem for us anyway. Ugh, the ’07 picks at the top.
Nobody wins them all, not even Wolf. He didn’t do all that FA stuff until he had only a couple of DL spots to fill, (1) receiver, and a KR. Bingo, sometimes thats all it takes.

In case anyone on this site doesn’t already have tickets to Sunday’s game – the 49ers just released a bunch of tickets back to the Packers so they released them on Ticketmaster. I’m in Texas so I can’t enjoy them but thought someone out here might… I was able to pull a 4-pack in section 106 row 60… here’s the link in case you’re interested… Not sure how long this will be a secret…

http://www.packers.com/tickets/single_game_tickets/

Something interesting just occurred to me – for giggles, I checked on endzone tickets in Jerry World here in Dallas and the same tickets you can get in Green Bay for $59 are $179 per ticket face value… Sometimes I wish I still lived in Wisconsin for opportunities like this… I’d make that drive on Sunday without a doubt…

Who says Colledge and Spitz are quality linemen? Fact is since 05 our line has been a mess, with the Rent-a-Guards from that year, Will Wittaker experiment blah blah blah. I agree with Oddball, five years to put together a working serviceable good line and yet we are at the top in sacks. Geez even Detroit who were using OFFENSIVE LINEMEN as defensive linemen because they had so many injuries recored five sacks. McCarthy has been there four, Thompson five, come on stop the musical chairs and find some linemen that can make the skill players go. How long has it been since weve seen Driver and Jennings streaking to and fro like they did in 07. And no Im not stuck in the past or in 07, Im staying lets get this crap fixed and win some games. I cant believe Thompson is so stupid as to not draft or sign or trade for a back up left tackle or a “swing” tackle that can play both guard and tackle. We’ve seen what happened with Ted’s plan for Colledge moving to LT once Clifton is done, it was a disaster. How long are we gonna keep signing over the hill ex Packers to try and fix the problems of today’s packers? Talk about living in the past…Tausher, Green? Next we will be bringing back Antonio Freeman. As for Randy Moss, yeah its like duh too late to correct that mess, so learn from it and improve the team. Why didnt we sign Levi Jones as a backup. For what Ted is paying Tausher and Green, he could have signed Jones AND Tausher, and that would be way better than what we have now. I think Barbre is finished. He has tried all over the line and just doesnt get the job done. I agree with the guy that spoke about Buffalo taking our rejects on the PS. Lets see if they will take Ted….no draft choices…just take him.

Oh, Monty, vintage year you picked. Clifton, O’Dwyer, Flannagan, Klemm, and Tausch. You didn’t mention that team went 4-12. By ’07 we had the guys we do now, but even tho they’re on the roster since then, they really haven’t played much together.

Hey Monty…best available player is why we drafted Brohm,,,and there is no discussion that at the time Brohm WAS the BAP. That same philosphy got Rodgers drafted even though we had Farve. and why we had brunnell and haselbeck when we had Favre. We can say those were wasted picks but the fact is that the draft is a crapshoot and injuries do occur which is why good gm’s think that way. For as bad as some say GB has drafted how would you like to be Cleveland or Oakland.

Finally..anyone remember the Wahle fiasco when he was drafted for tackle and flopped badly. It took years for GB to get a player and it was finally at guard. Flanagan didn’t even play until yr. 3 and could barely walk yr, 2..

Building a team takes time and luck and GB has had both in recent years dispite what we the fans think.

Someone mentioned bringing back Jago as OC, and I don’t think that’s gonna happen. And as long as speculation costs nothing, how about bringing in Steve Mariucci as assistant head coach?