Packers are done

After today’s debacle, it is clear the Packers should have kept Brett Favre. You all were right, I was wrong. Go Brett!

RIP Aaron Rodgers.

Thanks for your support over the years. it was fun while it lasted.

Over and out forever.

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  • iccyfan

    With the amount of sensible discussion that has ensued, Al should threaten to shut down his site every week! Other than Sammy’s drivel, it’s been a pleasure to read thru this morning’s messages…

  • http://www.yahoo.com SN

    I can excuse some of the misses in the draft IF they had been more active in free agency. The Vikings have had some nice draft picks in recent years (Peterson, Harvin, etc.), but look at who they picked up: Favre, Allen, Winfield, Hutchinson, etc.

    You cannot just build a team solely in the draft. This is the biggest criticism I have of TT.

  • Larry

    Now that we’ve beat the Viking game to death…any reason to expect that Rogers won’t get absolutely killed by Baltimore, Dallas, SF and Pittsburgh. These 4 games will go exactly the same way…inability to run…lots of passing and a brutal beatdown of Rogers.

    Maybe we could spend some of the $20M of cap money for a decent burial for AR.

  • Oddball

    Pretty nice spinjob there Larry. You in politics?

    There is not one player drafted by Ted Thompson for the OL or Front seven who could possibly qualify as an impact guy. Trades? Nope. Free agent? Not really. After five years with Ted Thompson at the helm, we are among the worst in both sacks for and sacks against, and that’s what we got playing one of the softest schedules I’ve ever seen. Five years after his departure as GM, 4 of the 6 impact defensive players are still Sherman-era acquisitions. ( I really want to include Matthews here as a feather in Thompson’s cap, but it’s just too soon.)

    Anybody here happy with the run game these days?

    Yes. Thompson gets bonus points for drafting Rodgers, Jennings and Collins. He also deserves great credit for bringing Woodson in, and I’m hoping Raji and Matthews demonstrate that he is improving as time goes on. All this gets pretty academic. It still comes down to winning and losing over the course of seasons, and we’re not there yet.

    We fired Ray Rhodes for one year at 8-8. We dismissed Mike Sherman as GM though he’d never had a losing season. We dismissed him as a HC after one losing season where we lost the whole interior of the O-line and suffered so many injuries that Donald Lee and Samkon Gado looked good. But Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy deserve our unwavering loyalty for as long as it takes? I’m not delusional in my expectations here – I want to see us at 9-7. I want to see some semblance of a pass rush. I want to see a little rushing success against a quality opponent. Am I being too hard on our leadership to hope for that?

    In hindsight, I don’t think Wahle was overpriced. I recall Thompson admitting in a candid moment that he was surprised by the interest in him. It happens. He was new to the GM thing. I’m not going to string him up over that one now, but the results in the trenches this year so far just cannot be tagged as acceptable much less good.

    Ted Thompson is part of that failure. Like I said before, I’m not sure how I’d distribute the blame between him and Coach Mike. I’m just not close enough to the team to say that.

    With all this negativity, I’m sticking by my statement that the only team on the schedule that really has be bucked is Pittsburgh. I think I’m going to get my 9-7.

  • http://jlworden1suddenlink.net LarryTex

    Can’t counter your arguements with any other fact data, Oddball, (probably ’cause I don’t want to) although I do know that MIN has 20% of their cap tied up in Favre, Hutchinson, and Allen. They also gave up a #1 and (2) #2s for Allen. They got lucky with Harvin and Favre is making Rice look All-World.
    I don’t think they can go all the way, but time will tell, I’ve been wrong before (mostly on the Packers).

  • TRIP

    I think it was justawake who reminded us how we barely and LUCKILY got A-rod in the draft. He was some mockers #1 pick a week or two before the draft, then fell all the way to #25. No move made by TT to get him, it was a simple common-sense steal when we knew Favre would not be in the QB in 2015. lol. So no accolades for acquiring A-Rod. And many defend TT’s idiotic management just because of A-Rod. Without A-Rod, his GM accomplishments do not outweigh the shortcomings.

  • Mike from Arizona

    Oddball – excellent post

    One thing not discussed by Larrytex is the money. If you get a first rounder who is a bust like (Harrell) it will cost you big time. The guarantied money given and base pay effects your future.

    The Packer, in general, need to stop pick Head Coaches with past ties to the organizaton. Look at the Starr and Gregg years.

    IMO – MM was picked because of his one year QB work under Holmgren. But in fact, MM had limited coaching experience at a high level and was never a Head Coach. His work in San Fran was sub-par before coming to the Packers.

    Holmgren and Lombardi were leader and disciplinarians. Starr, Gregg, MM know football but are not leaders nor disciplinarians.

    MM needs to go back and coach QB’s. Get Cowher, Shanahan, Holmgren, etc

  • Monty

    AL, You finally came over to the light! Since their divorce, Brett Favre is 16-8, TT/MM 10-13, guess we know who won that divorce.

    The team that Ted Built
    Offensive linemen and running backs cant run screens
    No Pass Rush
    No Pass Blocking
    No running game for cold weather

    Amhan Green as kick returner (no disrespect to Mr. Green, but the man is over done and never was a Kick returner.)
    Kicker who is not accurate
    Punter who’s net average is only 33.8 yards.

    We will be lucky to make it to 8-8 with Pittsburgh and Baltimore still ahead not to mention Dallas and da Bears in Chicago.

    Hey Mr. Murphy are you listening.

  • http://jlworden1suddenlink.net LarryTex

    Mike, you’re new to the post. Money is always a large concern to me, as most on this site will attest to, to the extent I’m always forced to defend the lack of spending on large $$ FAs. To wit my support of TT on Rivera/Whale and Hutch to MIN.
    On the other hand I was estatic when Wolf got REGGIE, Jones, Jackson, etc.
    I think, over time, MIN and Bearse are in serious trouble (but then MIN always has been).
    I came into this Packer thing at the end of the really lean $$ years when this franchise almost went under. Then all those 70/80 years. Thank God for revenue sharing. Good times now with $$ in the bank, great facility, rising young team, and a franchise QB. Wasn’t always so.

  • 25 Yrs Pack

    DE-Fan, go away.

  • iccyfan

    LarryTex Says: “Good times now with $$ in the bank, great facility, rising young team, and a franchise QB. Wasn’t always so.”

    Hallelujah! Most seasons in the 70′s and 80′s we had little to cheer for coming out of the gate, with a John Brockington here and Chester Marcol beating the Bears there, but too much Scott Hunter and Randy Wright in between! Devine’s trades and methods nearly killed us; under Bart, Forrest and Lindy, .500 was an acceptable season. Now we at least have hope and something to b!tch about…

  • 25 Yrs Pack

    Anytime a team is still competitive after loosing a franchise QB, it is a really good sign. We all got spoiled assuming division titles.

  • Larry

    LarryTex, what you say is accurate just not reality in this day and age…somewhere between Dan Snyder and Tampa Bay is where teams need to be to compete. We are two linemen away from chasing realistically for the North title. 31 sacks in 7 games is a testament to failure and I for one believe AR has gotten away from more sacks than he is blamed for.

    The NFL monster has 3 heads: draft/trade/ and free agency and GB chooses to minimize FA. And need I remind you that an excellent FA is still cheaper than Justin Harrell!

  • http://jlworden1suddenlink.net LarryTex

    iccy, whats that line about adversity breeds character, or something like that? Kinda like the tombstone that says “Frankly, I’d rather be alive.”. Well, frankly, I’d rather be winning, but it is what it is.
    I think its an advantage that TT is so unemotional, unlike the old days of which you speak. If, or when, he gets fed up with the (if it happens) undevelopment of the OL he’ll can MM in a heartbeat.
    As far as that goes, I’m totally disappointed with the Ds lack of pass rush. Capers seems to have a lock on the run D, but with the DBs we have, the pass D stinks. It comes down to the LBs and the fact that not one of them can cover a TE. I was a great adherent of the switch because I tho’t our LBs were better suited to the 3-4, but I’m second guessing myself now. From what I saw, Kampman was in the dirt a lot Sun but to no avail – I only saw him on Favre once.
    Jumping on TT now does absolutely no good, the problems are on the field, and maybe the sideline.

  • http://huh DE-Fan

    25 years Pack “DUDE” whatever – All I’m saying is that this is not Rodgers fault. If Rodgers would have gone to the Vikings and Favre would have stayed in GB, the Vikings would still have torn us a new one just like they did.

  • http://jlworden1suddenlink.net LarryTex

    No need to remind me, Larry, I totally agree. Draft is my base, FA is my supplement, and Trade has to be avoided at all costs. Draft is a 50-50 crap shoot, FA only when you need that special guy (singular, w/’95 the exception), and trades kill more often than not. I’ll repeat, again, because we have two great examples in our Div. CHI and MIN mortgaged their futures by giving away draft choices to win now. Come back to me in January when we really know how it turned out for them.

  • 25 Yrs Pack

    Incompetent irrational thinking with no basis or intelligence behind it. Just like arguing, well if we scored more points, we would have won. Except that “what if” argument makes sense and is provable. Jason Wilde, one of the dumber sports writers of our time, makes the argument you just made. Anyone who really beleives that a 2nd year started is doing better than a 18 Yr verteren hall of famer, who audibles at the line to change plays, AND CHANGE PROTERCTIONS, and still has one of the quickest release times in the league, doesnt have a clue about football. It makes me angry to win this argument because arguments like this are why AL ponders deleting this website. I just cant stant reading stupidty and having people beleive its fact. Now enough of that garbage….

  • 25 Yrs Pack

    Wood also agrees with me, he threw Arod under the bus. Said we couldnt get to him (bf) BECAUSE he would either change the play, change the protection, or get the ball out so quick it didnt matter how many we brought at him. Of course, if bf had Lang on his line, letting allen bascially dive off the line becuase he forgot that he has to block the NFL’s leading sacker that is right in front of him, that play might be different, but not all those plays we free fires like that.

  • 25 Yrs Pack

    now im done, this is why before the game, I said in my posts that if it is anything but a W that results, we should put this all behind us and look forward because these arguments are pointless. We should be done with the bf talk, only exception would be a future match up, which isn’t happening for atleast 9 more weeks if at all.

  • Jeremy (From Chicago)

    Has there ever been a QB with a 110 rating while getting sacked 30 times over a 7 game stretch? What AR has done has me real excited about the posibilities for the future.

    Would we have booed Fave if he came to town in a Jets uniform? I think I would have stood and cheered even if it was the SuperBowl.

  • 25 Yrs Pack

    Very Interesting A QB calculator that works!

    http://www.footballguys.com/qbrating.htm

  • ChrisAZ

    Read the one titled “Frustration and growing pains in green bay”. MM needs to go. Basically he’s ignoring his most prominent players such as jenkins, woodson, and kampman and telling them to shut up. MM says all he cares about is a top 3 defense..well that sounds nice doesnt it? But its not turning into W’s for the team. He’s so out of touch with the players and just needs to go. This is a win now league and what has he done for us lately?

  • packer_bob

    Oddball,

    Great post.

    Monty,

    It’s not really fair to make generalizations on Favre vs Rodgers based on a comparison of their records. There’s no way to know what Favre would have looked like on last year’s or this years Pack, and no way to know what Rodgers might have time on last year’s Jets or this year’s Vikes.

    Unfortunately, the rest of your post is all true.

    And guys, it’s a little strange to me that some would think the Steelers are the only challenge left on our schedule. I wouldn’t be looking past the Cowboys, Ravens, 49ers, Bears etc of the NFL right now. These are all winnable, but they’re also losable. We should be able to walk over the Bucs this week no matter what, but I wouldn’t be taking too much more than that for granted.

  • AATP

    ChrisAZ – I read the column, I think you’re grossly exaggerating the point of that article. The point is that when a team is winning no one can argue how a scheme works. When a team loses, players may make claim that something in the scheme didn’t work. However, if it didn’t work that day, does it mean it won’t work on other days? Remember, Capers defensive schemes were 0-6 coming into the season against BF. Why would anyone think NOW it would change? I certainly had hopes our offense would keep up in scoring and give us a chance to win, but in no way had any misconceptions that it would be the defense that did it for us. And no where in that article did I read anything about MM insinuating that the players “shut up” and just play. He specifically said that no one player is larger then the team and each person is accountable for doing what they are supposed to – no freelancing. Freelancing gets you beat because people are out of position. I just don’t think they have bought completely into this scheme yet – I think some have but not all have and that’s what’s causing the arguments. MM is just standing behind Capers scheme and trying to put things into perspective. Regardless of your feelings towards MM.

  • http://jlworden1suddenlink.net LarryTex

    Now, p_b, you know none of those games would count because the PIT are the best of the lot. Kinda like CLE and DET and STL don’t you think?

  • Oddball

    PB –

    Don’t get me wrong on that Steeler thing. All I’m saying is it’s the only one I would be very surprised to see us win.

    Yeah, we could lose another five games. Could lose to Detriot on Thanksgiving. But those are all games I think we *can* win without pulling the “any given Sunday” line.

  • packer_bob

    LT,

    I assume you’re joking? The Cowboys, Ravens, Niners and the Bears at home are all tougher victories thant the Lions, Browns, and Rams. I would put some stock in a dominating performance against any of them in a way I wouldn’t against the sad sacks of the league, including Tampa this week.

  • http://jlworden1suddenlink.net LarryTex

    Well, p_b, not fully, because any win we get will be tainted for what ever reason, and any loss will because we are such a lousy team and everybody should be fired.

  • Rocky70

    LT

    You know as well as everyone that PB will find something wrong with anyone GB defeats………. Defeat Dallas in a couple weeks & PB will downplay the win with something like, ” Dallas was nicked up for the game, so it’s not a ‘quality win’. “…….. Beat the Steelers a few weeks later: PBs response will be “Pittsburgh beat themselves, so it’s not a “quality win”……… You can’t win with PB because PB either doesn’t have a firm grasp of what the NFL is all about……. or……. he has little concern for GB to succeed as long as TT/MM are Packers………. Take your pick.

  • packer_bob

    Can you read? I just said beating the Cowboys, Ravens Niners or Bears in their house would be a quality win, at least the biggest we’ve had this season. Beating the Steelers in their house goes without saying.

    You know, it’s not really a matter of semantics guys. We’ve lost every chance we’ve had to beat somebody good this year, and beat up on all the cupcakes.

    Don’t shoot the messenger.

  • Darryl

    I would have loved to see Brett finish at GB. BUT, Aaron was a logical choice. I think MM + TT felt secure after the big contracts and gaudy 13 – 3 record. They were stupid because they didn’t seem to realize that Favre made a big different.

    Still, they made the decision for the future instead of throwing the dice one more time with Favre. Unfortunately, one more year became two and maybe three. If Favre had been easier to work with……